I find myself in an odd position. I dislike the show Extreme Couponing and all the negatives that will/are occurring due to highlighting “super couponers”. I truly think it would be best for all concerned if the show was immediately pulled and no more episodes were ever produced.
However, this past week an episode aired where one of the participants decoded her coupons to match her purchases. For those that do not know what decoding means, it is simply matching the barcode to what the scanner software reads the coupon barcode as “saying”. Many times this does not match the text of the coupon resulting in a “better” coupon for the customer, and sometimes a “better” coupon for the store/manufacturer.
People on forums in particular are running around with their hair on fire about the “fraud” of decoding, and how this person should be arrested, killed, “find her kid” and all sorts of other appalling statements. Cyper-bulling is alive and well in the sanctimonious world of “ethical” couponers.
Is decoding “fraud”? No court has judged the wording to supersede the barcode as the definitive “correct” version of a coupon.
Is decoding dead? At many stores yes. There are new industry standards which will go info full effect by July of this year. Many stores have already upgraded their software making most decoding a thing of the past.
Why is decoding a thing of the past?
In the olden days (1980s – two years ago) most coupon barcodes looked like this:
The first number told you whether it would double or not (5 = double, 9 = no doubles). The first five number-set were manufacturer identifiers. For people who knew now to read the numbers each section of the second five number-set meant something… cashier intervention, the quantity needed to be purchased, the amount to be deducted, etc.
With the new bar code, more parameters can be read by the scanner:
Start date of coupon, end date, more options for quantity and coupon amounts, etc. For example: while a $1/10 coupon was not possible with the short barcode, it is now possible with the long barcode. An expiration date of 3/13 was impossible with the short barcode, it is now possible with a long barcode. There are no longer limitations on what the computer can read on a coupon barcode.
Was what she did “wrong”? Well, your ethics and her ethics may disagree. I know my ethics and her ethics certainly do disagree! For those wondering if I decode – nope. I never learned. I did not want to be tempted. And believe me, it is a temptation to know the limitations of a program and not want to take advantage of it. Because I so disagree with what she did, I will not be linking to her site nor will I allow comments to link to her site. I do not want to give her any traffic that may in any way signal that I agree with her couponing methods, because I vehemently do not.
However, my ethics do not stoop to cyber-bulling someone just because I do not agree with their ethics.
I really do not know how this will all end. For the couponing world at large screaming to the authorities that someone decoded is not news. Back in 2003-2004 when the only arrest (and dismissal) I know of for decoding was made, the manufacturers seemed to get a wake up call that the loosey-goosey coding standards of the day were not in their best interest and to get on-board with the available technology to strengthen the coupon barcode system. Again, those changes will be complete in a few months.
What will happen to the average couponer? Possibly more scrutiny. After all, what better way to shine the light on the decoding this woman did than to contact local news stations, the local authorities and the manufacturers? That is suuuuuure to help the average couponer. (This last paragraph is sarcasm folks.)
All-in-all this is just a mess. There are people who love the show, hate the show, do not know any better, people are wondering how they can save $1500 at one time hint: you probably cannot, the show is staged for ordering, cash register over-rides, etc… in other words it is a reality show, not a show based in reality. Big difference. I’m not sure the genie can be put back in the bottle as the phantom economic recovery has left people fiscally strained.
It is sad what this show has wrought.
{ 25 comments… read them below or add one }
Well, I’m no stranger to all of this either. I totally don’t agree with the ethics of that woman either. URGH. It’s just another, greed of one person making it a heck of a lot more difficult for others.
In terms of the show – I already see the negative affects in my area. And as you all probably now, NYC is a pretty hard to coupon in area already. I’ve already had several people comment to me about this show. bad bad bad.
It makes me so tired of couponing, however, I think now is the time to stock up before the change over makes it really that much harder.
Thank you for your well-thought comments on this subject. I agree, the cyber-bullying and flat out accusations that I have yet to see “solid proof” for are abundant & discouraging (cutting & pasting already doctored “clips” is not exactly solid proof). I also would not participate in such coupon activity, but I am afraid the actual response is putting couponers in a worse light…that of being mean, bullying, accusing, negative people. I’m not sure what the point of those who are attacking is. Why not just let her reap what is sown?
Thanks Ann for your careful thoughts and comments. I didn’t know what all the fuss was about (only caught the last few minutes of the show………….probably on purpose). But after seeing a couple of comments here and there I dug (albeit, it didn’t take much!) and found a lot of dirt. I was very disheartened by the very cruel comments fellow couponers made about this person’s looks, actions, etc. I understood the anger at the asserted coupon fraud, but to attack her person? I felt like I was reading a junior high rant on some girl that had fallen out of favor. Mean and hurtful as it gets.
Do I agree with what she is accused of doing? Heck no. I do however believe in a system of justice and she has been tarred and feathered without a trial.
Yes in the end, this hurts us all in more serious ways than how much we can save.
Although I don’t agree with her manner of couponing, I also feel bad for her. I didn’t know about this until someone posted a comment on this blog last week. Once I dug I got more than I bargined for. And we wonder where our kids learn it.
Wow!! I shouldn’t be surprised about cyber-bullying. But I guess in my naive way of thinking, THAT NEVER crossed my mind. I’m upset that a few extreme couponers will get their 15 minutes of fame and ruin what has been a God-send to my family. To be able to put food on the table, and try to help others in need. Did any of these folks consider the consequences that could occur, or did they just think about showing-off? Shame on TLC for taking the approach that they did. They could’ve produced a program, that could’ve taught others how to coupon and save and how we can help each other in these difficult times.
Personally, I think everyone’s anger is aimed at the wrong target. While I don’t agree with the methods displayed on the show, I am angrier at TLC for so completely missing the point of couponing. Couponing is a valid way for the consumer to help provide for their family and, sometimes, contribute to food banks and shelters in their community. TLC missed a wonderful opportunity to showcase the good couponing can do and to educate others on how to use this valuable tool. What could have been a helpful and uplifting show turned into a showcase of fraud and hoarding. I really believe that, done correctly, this show could have had better ratings and could definitely have had a positive impact. What a shame that the powers that be at TLC were too short-sighted to see this.
Ultimately I think the show is going to make couponing even “cooler” and for those of us that are long time coupon users it is going flub things up. I have already noticed a lot of bad that the show has brought about and I can’t imagine what more is to come. Policies are changing, there is no doubt in that.
I have known about decoding for years but I never used it, I always felt like that was wrong because if the store was audited they would not get paid…felt like stealing to me. I have known others that have done it though, and with a good bit of success.
I really just want to say shame on TLC, you would think they would have a moral code when it comes to things like this.
With all the uproar, has TLC responded to any of this or made a statement?
I guess I am missing something. I don’t know much about decoding a coupon but I don’t see what is wrong with it. I’ve had so much grief with some coupons lately that it would be nice to know what products would work. I haven’t been able to use any of the Colgate Palmolive coupons lately because they come up as “item not found” when I am buying the item mentioned in the wording. I couldn’t use a Colgate toothpaste coupon for Colgate toothpaste at CVS a few weeks ago. I haven’t even attempted to use them at Rite Aid lately because I haven’t had one work since they started coding “9 935000….”. I suspect that the second 9 might be the problem since their manufacturer’s code is 35000. A few months ago, I was having problems with some medicine coupon. I studied the products on the shelf and found that some had the same manufacturer’s code as the coupon and others didn’t. I bought the ones with the matching codes and was able to use the coupons. If I didn’t understand the stuff about the manufacturer’s code on the coupons, I wouldn’t have known what the problem was. I don’t see any ethical problems with any of this. I didn’t watch the show because I don’t get TLC. What is wrong with consumers knowing why coupons that are supposed to be working according to the wording don’t work?
Gita…Here is what you are missing, and what is so wrong. “Decoding” is considered coupon fraud. The item being purchased needs to match the coupon description. The coupon shopper suffers no ill effects from using the wrong coupon for an item. They get their dollar off and go on their merry way. “Decoding” will get an employee fired. It is a retail associate’s responsibility to match each coupon to an item. When you have a couponer that uses a coupon for every item that they purchase, it sometimes gets confusing for the cashier to match every coupon to every item. Sadly, many couponers do not care about the employees. They are too concerned with getting the deal, regardless if it is a legal coupon transaction or not. The selfishness of some couponers can affect the jobs and livelyhood of retail workers if coupons are not used correctly. The dollar that you make incorrectly can cost a cashier their jobs. Still don’t see any ethical problems with using the wrong coupon?
Here is what you are missing: there has been no court decision which determines what takes precedence, the text or the barcode. How can it be “fraud” if the barcode says the coupon is good off XX to redeem it off XX?
Once the new software is in place, and the coupon’s text and barcode will match, that is the point where using a coupon on something not listed on either the text or barcode would be misusing the coupon.
Prior to that point, it is just against your ethics to have someone decode. Ethics and legalities do not always coincide.
Ann
I would be very careful giving legal advice, it can get you in serious trouble. I am not a lawyer, but I did go to law school. A coupon meets the legal definition of a contract. There are plenty of case that do find that the wording, and the intent, of a contract is binding. Intent, how the person drawing up the contract intended for it to be implemented, actually plays a large part in the judges decision. However, a coupon, as a contract, has so little value, that court fees alone would exceed any judgment. So yes, it is highly unlikely that anyone will sue you over the misuse of a coupon. However, the act of fraud is criminal, and if your intent is to commit fraud, I would be careful, as one day the stores and the manufacturers might decide to team up with law enforcement to make an example of someone.
Yes Kaci, I agree. The people who call this “fraud” without a legal ruling naming it as such really should be careful when they speak of people who decode. Libel and Slander ARE legally defined terms – as any attorney can tell you.
Ann
i made a similiar reply on another, similar topic earlier….i have watched all of the new Extreme Couponing shows and there was never any mention of “decoding” on the show. i am in the belief that someone may have started a witch hunt without any real proof to support it. i assume someone tried to determine exactly how the Extreme Couponer got her items for the price featured on the show by trying to figure out what items were purchased and what coupons were available for those products. unless someone can direct me to a copy of her receipt from the show, i am going to assume that these allegations are not based in reality. further more, if you didn’t watch the show, and many people claim to be avoiding it on principle, you shouldn’t comment on the the goings on featured on the show. you’re either fibbing about not watching or you’re getting your information second hand, assuming that the person you’re getting it from is reporting it correctly. these anti-Extreme Coupon blogs are getting to be llke a bad episode of Gossip Girl. er, Gossip Couponer, i guess.
Ann, you have one of the most richest (in quality) blogs I have seen, thank you.
Just to clarify, what did she do exactly, explain how to read bar codes, or use a coupon the way it was coded, as opposed to the way it was worded?
It was my understanding it’s rare for a coupon’s wording to not match it’s coding.. dunno how true that is though. I do quick checks for errors (example was one of Physician’s Formula $5 qs), but since 95% of my shopping occurs with cashiers and not self check outs, wording is what we go by; I’d fight a cashier on wording, but never on a barcode.. I mean how could you? They aren’t supposed to know anymore than you do.
Not in my over 10 years of couponing have I ever heard of “decoding.” But in reading your post, if I understand correctly, it only means that someone has figured out the bar code. Okay…so big deal. If the coupon gives you $2/1 item and expires on 4/12/11, what do you gain by knowing if it doubles or not, or anything else? Even if the code says it can be doubled, all couponers know that if a store policy is that the store does NOT double, it doesn’t matter what the coupon says. I just don’t understand all the fuss, and I don’t understand why anyone should care since it makes no difference at all (from my point of view) in the checkout line.
As to bullying on any level, I am a victim of it, having dealt with it from my earliest childhood to my more recent employers and co-workers. Although stating the obvious, bullying is never acceptable, never accomplishes anything, and is ALWAYS hurtful. But over little slips of paper? I applaud your efforts, Ann, at trying to keep bullying off your blog, but even here I read lots of comments from folks who think that it’s “their way or the highway” and all the rest of us are “thieves, misinformed, stupid, illegal, unethical”…and any of a dozen other adjectives I’ve heard us called. And seriously…all this over saving a few cents, trying to feed families and survive? The adjective that comes to my mind to describe what those folks are doing is “sad.”
The reason that some people think it’s a big deal is because if you know how to decode, you can figure out how to apply the coupon to a completely different product by the same manufacturer. For example, you could have a coupon which states that it is valid for $1 off Cereal X, which costs $4.49 and is not on sale, but you could potentially use it on Cereal Y, for which there is no coupon, but which is on sale for $1.67.
I know how to decode a coupon barcode, and I don’t think “decoding is wrong,” (it’s just knowing how to read a barcode. sometimes it is very useful in figuring out why a coupon won’t scan when you have purchased the correct items) but I won’t use the information to buy items which are not described in the text on the coupon. It seems fairly obvious to me, whether it’s been legally established or not, that the fact that barcodes, up until now, haven’t individually detailed every possible combination of items, sizes, expiration dates, and coupon values that a manufacturer and/or store could sell is/was a function of the limitation of the old barcoding system. To ME, the text supercedes the barcode.
If the manufacturer audits the store’s receipts, are they going to reimburse the store for 100 coupons for Cereal X, when the store sold 100 boxes of Cereal Y instead? Or will the store take the loss for that $100 worth of coupons? I don’t know what happens in every case, but since you can get plenty of good deals by following the terms which are written on the coupons, I’m not willing to put the store, which already has razor-thin profit margins, at risk of being denied reimbursement. Nor am I willing to put cashiers at risk of being fired… Know what I mean?
I am disappointed that her episode has not been pulled by TLC. Last night it was on again…..very disappointing. As a couponer for over 25 yrs, I feel enough pressure being scrutinized over every coupon in some of the stores and it is only going to get worse. ( yes, I started couponing very young and got married young….LOL) I have to say, the other couponers spent a more realistic amount at the grocery store. Of course they do not show the drug stores and couponing.
For those wondering why decoding is considered “wrong” by many couponers (myself included) – it is the lengths decoders used to go to to redeem the coupons.
As an example, many moons ago, there were monistat coupons that scanned off on anything. People would go into a store and use (20) $5 monistat coupons on $100 worth of meat and produce. The coupon worked, so the decoders thought nothing of it.
There are many more examples of these types of coupons and the decoding practices of people. It was not simply, “oh this coupons says $1/10 yogurt or $1/2 4 packs, so I can use it on 2 single cups!” type of decoding. It was serious “WTF!!” kinds of things like the monistat, and what most long-time couponers think of when it comes to decoding.
Ann
I completely agree with you Ann. Decoding is wrong and it hurts all of us the “follow the rules” ethical and otherwise. Just because the coupon scans doesn’t mean you’re using it correctly. I love a good deal as much as the next girl, but I’d never purposefully use a coupon meant for another product just because I knew the computer would misread the coupon. Unfortunately, I’m already seeing the consequences of the extreme couponers at my local A&P. All of the sudden this Sunday there were big signs on every register that said that store would now only accept “Two Internet coupons per customer per day” Not two “alike” coupons, Two coupons Total! ugg. Shame on TLC for promoting a show about excess and abuse, not learning a skill to stretch a dollar.
Ladies, thank you for all the additional insight and education. First of all, this is the first time I’ve ever even heard the term “decoding,” and second, I guess that since it wouldn’t occur to me to use an “X” coupon for a “Y” product, nor would I think or expect a cashier to take it, the concept just struck me as foreign.
As an aside but something along the same vein, I’ve had a Rite Aid manager tell me that this is a huge problem with their in-store coupons. Apparently, ALL of their in-store coupons will ring up, regardless of the product being purchased. So, in theory, you could use a hair color in-store coupon to buy a can of cat food. I guess it all boils down to ethics and integrity. I’m not going to put a cashier’s job at risk just so I can buy that can of cat food. Ludicrous! But there are con artists and cheats everywhere, in every aspect of business and politics. Couponing is just the latest to have the spotlight shined upon it.
This is why I so enjoy your blog, Ann. It’s the “and more” that makes it interesting and different. Such thought provoking subjects highlighted on this blog. These are issues that affect us all and we should be well informed; on both sides of the coin.
I like that although we clearly have different opionions, we keep it civil. You may be on to something , Ann. Perhaps our polical leaders could debate this way. Blog only debates; no interrupting, no yelling…just the fact, ma’am!
I meant “just the facts, Ma’am”
Greetings… OK, I’m new to this game but one thing seems really obvious to me. The most time consuming work is collecting, parsing and storing the coupons until the right time to use them.
The barcodes of an item tells you some great information for that purpose, including: doubling; manufacturer, family or product code; and value of the coupon. It seems to me that it would be a great way to scan your coupon into a database that you can search.
No fraud here.
Would I be tempted? I’m tempted to do a lot of things everyday that I manage to get passed; I think barcode fraud is really low on my temptation totem pole.
I think the coding system is silly. I have had coupons “beep” at the register and been told they aren’t valid on the product I have even though the picture matches and the description. The “code” was throwing an invalid response to the product coupon match-up. I get them all the time, for products that are pictured on the coupon and match the description. No product sold for this coupon. What? If the coding system was correct as people assume then that wouldn’t EVER happen. Of course, P&G constantly comes out with $1.00 off ONE Tide Detergent coupon. It has no size restrictions and the darn thing randomly beeps on several products, including the Tide Trial Size pouches. But.. if the company didn’t want you to use the coupon on the Trial Size Pouches, it only has to say Excludes Trial Sizes. The couponing companies I think are frauds too… They know, they have to KNOW, those types of coupons BEEP on certain products. They continually refuse to put specs on coupons, rely on a “defunct coding system”, but want everyone to play fairly. I’m sorry, but after using coupons now for a long time, I can tell you that P&G is probably banking on the fact that you will take that coupon and when it beeps instead of standing up for yourself will just buy the product without the coupon, why hassle? So… J’aime found a way to verify which products the coupons go with.. is it fraud? questionable, because no court or law has said it is. J’aime has also been caught TWO times (TLC, Target Youtube) and admitted on national TV she used decoding methods to buy products. Yet, not one law agency, corporation or couponing company has done anything about it. In the end, don’t just point the finger at the customers.. it’s the coupon companies and the big corps who should be shamed as well for not providing a better system and wording. They leave it to the stores and customers to duke it out.
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